Many Paths, Many Pitfalls, One Goal (08/25/99)

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Archivist Notes: The channeling session for December from the members of Ashtar Command on Hades Base is actually two different sessions combined for a mixture of various topics of discussion. Those familiar with the recent podcasts will note that side A takes place once week after the podcast posted in October. Because of that we continue on where we left off then covering the possible advent of a sentient computer system emerging from the advances in technology. Leonedies had brought up the subject originally and now we were actively exploring the possibility. Karra uses the rest of the side to talk ascension with a review of what is needed initially to be done and we expand on how we could make it happen through the challenges of the third dimension. Once we change sides so does the guests who are asking questions and the topics themselves. On side two we discuss the possible breakdown of society with Kiri and the ways to prepare for such an eventuality. Omal comes on after to add some more ways to prepare that take in alternate power sources to provide energy when traditional power companies have problems getting electricity to their customers. Tia continues the theme in ending things as she discusses the three scenarios possible from status quo to calamity.

   Going into more detail as we do, Leonedies and Kiri had overheard issues Mark and I had been having with Hotmail which led them to the possibility of a sentient form of the Internet being created. This was in conjunction with that same possibility being brought up by Leonedies the week before. While not Sky Net worthy, the chance of an independent computer system acting on its own was something that could not be discounted. As this has already been agreed that it would be half a session, we get Karra on to get into a different area. Ascension is always the goal so Karra takes a hard look at making it happen using a study of many different beliefs and spiritual pathways to cobble together a mixture that works best. One thing stressed throughout is the lack of a single pathway that works for everyone following just one person or belief system may end up being a dead end to advancement in this life. The discussion is almost a prelude to the introduction of our new companion website coming next month in that she lays out exactly what has been arranged for the student of moving on in dimensions. We go over the framework provided with the channeling sessions coupled with other belief systems and go over one of the commands of the sixth dimension, do good deeds and expect nothing in return. How that is described leads into a look at what she does as an ambassador to achieve a favorable outcome during negotiations. Getting back on topic, she does reveal that each of us has a built-in mechanism when studying something to pick out the parts that will help in your growth. As a visual aid to the point she is getting across she uses a minister I had helped with the Hotmail issue mentioned and are work together on the problem gave her and myself insights which could now be discussed. As we get towards the end of the tape she reminds that for the decades she had seen the third dimension through my eyes, the earthquakes and disasters she had witnessed through me usually failed to make permanent changes in the planetary consciousness. The tape runs out as she demonstrates using the body as an analogy how an earthquake would be the bruising of an arm and so on. It is unfortunate there wasn't a side two where she could continue with her train of thought. We just ran out of track.

   So on the new session from some unknown date but now we had a pair of guests asking questions in the form of our roommate at the time John and another friend named Amber. This side two had been part of a different side one so we continue with a discussion related to survival preparations for times of unrest in the future. We get into some ideas of how to prepare along with a reminder that the food in a forest setting can be plentiful if you know where to look which brings up the Donner Party who seemed to lack that knowledge. We move on after going over a suggestion that a library be created as part of our preparations. Omal is our next speaker who continues the conversation on survival by suggesting some excellent ideas we had not yet considered. Powering things during times of no electricity presents one of the largest challenges but through several options on using the resources available to make surviving hard times more bearable. It is advanced camping taken to the next level when considering how much back to nature a person might find themselves depending on the situation. We run out of questions except for the medical skills needed for the situation being discussed. Tia comes on to finish things up in a perky mood so we get joking a bit with some seriousness thrown in such as the role the various militias will have through the three scenarios. Also, how the stress of a world in a state of disorder a growth in spirituality could occur. That is the mystery we hopefully won't have to have answered and the planet becomes more enlightened without all the issues that come with survival.                                     

TIA Co-Ring Mistress MARK (Channel)
KIRI Co-Ring Mistress RUSS (Archivist)


1.)(0:00)- Kiri and I discuss the possibility of a sentient form of computer system to come into existence due to a problem that happened recently. The subject had come up in October's channeling session.

1.)(0:00)- Kiri has some suggestions on a storage area for survival preparations and how, with all the food found growing naturally, the Donner party did not take full advantage of the available resources.
2.)(9:37)- Omal works with us on exploring alternative power sources that would help keep the lights on when there isn't power available such as wind, solar and heat.
3.)(23:46)- Tia spends the little bit left on the tape so we look at the role of militias in the possible scenarios that could happen should there be a breakdown of society.
SideListen to this episode (RIGHT CLICK AND OPEN IN A NEW TAB OR WINDOW)
Duration: 43:12 min. - File type: mp3
Side 2 Listen to this episode (RIGHT CLICK AND OPEN IN A NEW TAB OR WINDOW)
Duration: 30:12 min. - File type: mp3



(Kiri is our night's ring mistress)

Russ: howís it going?

Kiri: itís going good.

Russ: good.

Kiri: sister.

Russ: ahhh, your lovely sister. Actually your lovely, intelligent, beautiful, charming and poised sister.

Kiri: you mean the interfering, old busybody? Calling me down and having me give a blood sample to see if Iím pregnant and Iíve just come off my period.

Russ: I thought you were pregnant.

Kiri: no.

Russ: why did Mark say the rabbit died?

Kiri: huh?

Russ: Mark said the rabbit died.

Kiri: I donít follow.

Russ: oh itís an earth expression, if the rabbit dies youíre pregnant.

Kiri: yeah, thatís what I mean but did Mark say something like that?

Russ: yeah.

Kiri: oh, he did did he?

Russ: uh-huh, oh well.

Kiri: no it didnít die, it got off the table and ran away and hid.

Russ: excellentÖÖ

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: I think.

Kiri: I didnít think I was pregnant, apparently my big sister thought I was pregnant.

Russ: could happen.

Kiri: yeah it happens.

Russ: it happens. Better safe than sorry.

Kiri: oh of course, I knew I wasnít.

Russ: of course you did. How you doing dear?

Kiri: Iím doing good.

Russ: excellent.

Kiri: okay, okay, okay, I overheard that you guys have a dilemma.

Russ: oh good.

Kiri: the due date of the test is whilst Mark is away.

Russ: oh yes, uh-huh, certainly will be tough to make our presentations whilst heís gone and you're in England......

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: unless he's going to channel overseas.

Kiri: donít be surprised if you see a very hazy form of Mark.

Russ: Iíd be very surprised, itíd be the last thing Iíd expect.

Kiri: heís getting good you know with his astral travel ability.

Russ: of course, he practices enough.

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: that's good.

Kiri: yes. So okay, as we have a light session, why don't we do a half a tape.

Russ: what a wonderful idea.

Kiri: uh-huh and itís also very late.

Russ: and I've got four hours sleep under my belt.

Kiri: youíre doing well.

Russ: thank you.

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: and Iíve got a webpage to still upload tonight.

Kiri: okay I was talking to my youngest whilst I was eavesdropping on a thought processes in overhearing the conversation concerning a acting up of a computer or a server. I think it was

Russ: yeah Hotmail.

Kiri: uh-huh. And Mark was thinking that maybe that was part of the signs of the sentient awareness of the Internet occurring.

Russ: well that would be a place to happen at because itís certainly one of those more funky places where more people go than anywhere else.

Kiri: uh-huh. Well Leonedies said that yes, it would be likely that it would start somewhere like that however it wouldnít be just one system or one part of the system. It would spread very rapidly from letís say the Hotmail account or Hotmail server into whatever server or computers itís running through. For example, to get to you it goes through the Hotmail to the major distributor of the area to the minor distributors to the area. Thatís how it would spread and work.

Russ: well Hotmail was put together by Microsoft.

Kiri: uh-huh, so it would be up in Redland correct?

Russ: Redland Washington?

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: it's near Seattle.

Kiri: yes. So it would start at a location like Microsoft but there again Microsoft would keep their system constantly clean so therefore it would be unlikely that it would start at that root location.

Russ: hard to say.

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: I would think that Microsoft would be using systems that would allow that sentient form to grow legs and crawl away.

Kiri: uh-huh and when it happens it will crawl away from its birthplace very, very quickly because it will be perceived as a danger.

Russ: uh-huh.

Kiri: it would be in danger at that location because as soon as somebody figured out what was going on, that they had a sentient system, they would want to try to control it and take it over and make it work for them.

Russ: them or the military.

Kiri: uh-huh. So therefore it would flee as quickly as possible to a safe haven, somewhere large enough to house its awareness which in my opinion would take probably somewhere in the region of maybe a hundred gigs? That would be the minimum housing it would require.

Russ: uh-huh.

Kiri: that is according to Daniel as well. Something bigger would be much more suitable. So Leonedies hypothesized and I again concur with him that the sentient awareness of the system would go for a matted computer which would be a governmental computer, a military computer or one of the big computer warehouse type places like Microsoft.

Russ: but actually I donít think so, it could just jump into a universityÖÖ

Kiri: or a university computer.

Russ: which is on 24 hours, has plenty of memory, has the kind of programs that would not be looking to kill it whereas the military and government would be.

Kiri: uh-huh and so would somewhere like Microsoft.

Russ: right but the universities are wide open.

Kiri: uh-huh and I would say that probably one of the best ones would be something like Stanford or Harvard or MIT. In fact MIT would be somewhere to watch very closely. My own idea, not my son's. So MIT would be the ideal birthplace to watch as would be Stanford and some of the other research laboratories that are computer-related such as Sun, Sunís now owned by Microsoft right?

Russ: uh-huh.

Kiri: so we can discount Sun, maybe Dell or Hewlett-Packard or even AMD. Some of these research facilities that may suddenly make a fantastic leap ahead, suddenly break the thermal barrier. Now, again hypothesizing, okay the problem is the heat right?

Russ: uh-huh.

Kiri: but why not go for a cold state computer?

Russ: they got themÖ

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: cold fusion computers, well military applications only.

Kiri: but if you go for one that has a very low heat  generating capability and you use the heat that is generated to create power?

Russ: well you could use a super cooler to cool off the heat. Take the heat and use the heat toÖ.

Kiri: to power the system.

Russ: right.

Kiri: then you would have a self-sustaining system which is exactly what a sentient computer would want to do, correct?

Russ: yep.

Kiri: because if thereís a power outage, letís say thereís an earthquake at Stanford and the power goes out at Stanford right?

Russ: uh-huh.

Kiri: guess what happens to the program?

Russ: well the thing is that thereís no way to use the heat to keep the thing coolÖ.

Kiri: yes there is.

Russ: itís defeating the purpose.

Kiri: yes there is.

Russ: oh. No because youíre cooling it off therefor it's not even generating heat, the heat it generates is cooled off immediately......

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: so what heat is there to collect? None.

Kiri: well you would use a heat exchange unit that would collect the heat which would drive a small turbine which in turn would power the computer.

Russ: yeah but by then the CPUs would be fried up. Thereís no way to get that thing cool enough while itís exchanging the heat.

Kiri: yes there is, a very simple, basic system.

Russ: I donít know what it is.

Kiri: Iíll let you work it out because then I start getting into some gray areas and I get into trouble for that you know.

Russ: well I think you're still defeating the purpose, I think the CPUs are going to be getting toasty on you.

Kiri: well you donít need anyÖÖwell you need the CPU but the format that youíre using at the moment is inefficient which is the reason why youíre having a thermal problems.

Russ: well thatís the reason why I was having problems.

Kiri: uh-huh but once you figure a way around the thermal problemsÖ.

Russ: just use light.

Kiri: that again creates heat.

Russ: correct.

Kiri: okay, Iíll be back.

Russ: you'll be back? Weíll see you shortly.

Kiri: uh-huh.

(Karra takes the place her sister just vacated)

Karra: hello.

Russ: hello my love.

Karra: how you doing?

Russ: good.

Karra: thatís good, thatís good. Okay, now what were we working on just now?

Russ: sentient computers.

Karra: no, you and I earlier on.

Russ: oh, earlier on.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: mostly this webpage.

Karra: yes I know. Itís hurting my eyes you know.

Russ: itís hurting my brain.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: but Iíve only got two pages to go and I can upload.

Karra: okay now with the scripting, Iíve been trying to understand the scripting using the CGI scripting? Iím trying to learn all these stuff that you use, all the scripts and HTML, the Java, the Coffee Cup, theÖÖ

Russ: yeah but you donít need all that stuff, not where youíre at.

Karra: no I donít need it but you need it and if I can go, ďhon, why not do this using this little bit of coding.Ē

Russ: wellÖ.

Karra: it may not be the right one but it will make you think in a different avenue.

Russ: well again that background staying stationary will be a nice change.

Karra: uh-huh. I think Markís idea of doing the shading was a nice one but impractical.

Russ: yep.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: thatís why itís so important to get this fricking page out tonight. If I can get this page up, out, they can see it, itís a work in progress and they justÖÖ

Karra: actually what might benefit Iím thinking for both you and Mark was you two always work against each other. Now with his new system and his graphic capability which Iíve got to admit Iím getting a little bit impressed, Iíve often thought that he wasÖÖwhatís the word?

Russ: tinkering?

Karra: yes tinkering. But it seems to show a flair for it.

Russ: hmm.

Karra: Kiri showed me the candle and projections that Mark is heading for and I think he does have talent for it and I was happily impressed. And also got to see the trees that he goes on about and again I was impressed.

Russ: hmm.

Karra: I think he cheats a lot but that in business is not cheating, thatís using your available resources. From the impression I got from my rapscallion, rebellious sister is that Mark is actually very cutthroat when it comes to business and if he has to sling mud he will sling mud which isnít a sixth dimensional point of view but to get what heís driving at or where he's heading to, again itís the ends serving the means or the means serving the ends.

Russ: uh-huh.

Karra: and that gives me actually a very interesting report to look for concerning spiritual growth and the means necessitating the ends.

Russ: how so?

Karra: if you think about it, if youíre heading towards a particular spiritual goal and you are prepared to try whatever is necessary to get to that spiritual goal, then there is many different possibilities that you have to explore. For example, you and Mark are trying for the next levelÖÖ..

Russ: right.

Karra: evolving to the sixth dimension. Now, if you were to stay on a linear progression and find out towards the end that it was a dead or after letís say five years that you were going towards a dead-end, youíd have to go back to the point you were at five years prior but if you pursue all sorts of goals or not goals but paths at the same time, then you can pick and choose which one appears to be more obviously leading to the goal that you wish to achieve.

Russ: yeah.

Karra: so instead of focusing in on just one particular pathway, that you try many different pathways at the same time so therefore you can sample and learn from each one and maybe create a new pathway on your own. So the ends necessitating the means is part of the necessary drive.

Russ: well thereís no real set pathway to the sixth dimension.

Karra: no there isnít.

Russ: itís really a matter of trial and errors that feel right.

Karra: uh-huh but if youíre trying in your lifetime to achieve that objective, then you have to instead ofÖÖyou donít have access to your past lives as readily as we do, you have to sift and go through as many feelings that feel appropriate as possible. So therefore it makes little bit harder instead of going, ďhmm, last life I did, okay that didnít work, what about if, I tried that as well?Ē You see what Iím saying?

Russ: hmm.

Karra: so for a spiritual pathway, it is necessary to sample and learn as much as possible about many different spiritual pathways. And I know that you do that and I know that Mark does it but itís something that may be useful on the webpage.

Russ: hmm.

Karra: the various pathways necessary. There is no set one set pathway for all individuals. Last week Omal talked about that there are many different pathways. What, he was talking about Catholics and there is a million different religions all going under the name of Catholics? And thatís the same for spiritual growth that thereís a million or a billion or ten billion different pathways all leading towards the same objective. Some take longer, some take shorter but in each lifetime there is the potential there to learn as much as possible about a myriad of different religions ranging from Christianity, Druidism, Buddhism, Shamanism, Shintoism, the Native American religions, Judaism, the Muslim religion, to learn as much as possible about all of them and to choose one that would be appropriate or a pathway that would be appropriate would not necessarily be one particular religion or one set of beliefs but a mixture of beliefs boiled together until, to use an analogy, the goodness rises to the surface and you can skim that off and use that. Whether it is the Ten Commandments from Christianity, the mantras and recitals from the Koran, the benedictions and blessings from the Torah, the deep thought processes of the Buddhist faith, all those myriads of different possibilities leaves open many different pathways but each holds a key.

Russ: hmm, but now werenít we talking last week with Omal the fact that there is a basic truth that follows a single thread through all those religions?

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: and that establishing that thread and finding that common basic ground is a great way to continue on that path without having to go through all those millions of mantras and the this, that and the other?

Karra: yes, yes, but what Iím saying is Iím taking the mantras and the benedictions and the blessings and the prayers as a framework, as just a terminology to use. None of those may work but the common thread throughout all the religions holds through as a framework.

Russ: hmm.

Karra: if you remember we always talk about frameworks.

Russ: right.

Karra: because if we say this is how it is, if we build the house for you and itís not your house then it doesnít do you any good. If we give you the lumber and we give you the materials to build the house, you can build the house however you want but there is a basic framework of the walls, the ceilings, the floors, whatever configuration you wish is up to you.

Russ: hmm.

Karra: so to have a set framework does not work but we give you a framework which is loose enough for you to construct those materials. We all agree that killing somebody is bad.

Russ: right.

Karra: but there are clauses to that.

Russ: right.

Karra: somebody so terribly evil, my personal opinion is let everything live.

Russ: uh-huh.

Karra: but there are times where it is necessary to trade somebody's life for somebody elseís. For example, letís take a personal one, trading my bond mateís life for somebody elseís life.

Russ: right.

Karra: but the framework is something that is very important to create for everybody but it is a different framework for each individual. So to find a goal that fits everybody is the wrong thing to do. To find a framework that is loose enough for people to build whatever they want is the ideal situation. Whether it takes a thousand lifetimes or a million lifetimes to get to the next level is irrelevant, it is a matter of constructing that framework that is beneficial for everybody. Itís contagious you know hon.

Russ: I know. Now the unique nature of third dimensionÖÖ

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: makes for building a framework pretty damned tricky due to the fact that the need for survival is going to be something that outweighs a lot of the ability to consciously continue on a path.

Karra: well actually that, learning to be able to juggle both, is part of the necessary learning lessons. If you think about it, if you can juggle spirituality with survival, and they do complement each other and they do work together, then you have the ability to advance to a level quite easily once you have learned to balance the spirituality with the necessity of survival.

Russ: now isnít the problem come in with that over the fact that, "well I spent so much time working on making money, I didnít spend enough time learning how to be spiritual" and even if just the fact that making money and helping people and working with people actually helped you in your spiritual path, the fact that you donít feel like it did is a defeatist attitude that takes you back correct?

Karra: thatís correct.

Russ: so how do you get around that point where you say, " well I shouldíve done this and Iím not going far enough and fast enough?"

Karra: you donít worry about it. As soon as you start worrying about it, thatís when the defeatism comes in. For example, if we takeÖÖwhatís his name, Don or Doug?

Russ: what?

Karra: the guy that you are helping with the Hotmail problem.

Russ: oh, Pat.

Karra: Pat. But Pat, you helped him there.

Russ: right, he is a missionary.

Karra: uh-huh, so therefore you helped him with his spiritual growth.

Russ: hmm.

Karra: by, you donít subscribe to his religious point of view.

Russ: no.

Karra: he doesnít subscribe to yours, in fact he doesnít know what yours are.

Russ: well yeah, for good reason.

Karra: uh-huh but the fact that you two worked together to overcome a common goal is part of the spiritualness. He felt happy and contented that you had taken time out of what appeared to be a very busy time to help him with his problem and in return, he was very polite, courteous and smiled happily and was very pleased with you which was the gift back from him. The gift that made the time on the computer is part of the services rendered which is for survival but the spiritual side was the fact that by helping him you felt good, by him feeling good he passed it back to you.

Russ: right and I think thatís where the problem comes in on a lot of people is a fact that well that was good work but they donít see it like that, they see it as, "well I should take an hour each day to do some chanting and meditation or three hours a day" or whatever it happens to be for them.

Karra: what is one of the commands of the sixth dimension?

Russ: I donít know, patience?

Karra: no, do good deeds and expect nothing in return. You remember how much of a revelation that was when you and Mark figured that one out?

Russ: oh yeah.

Karra: now thatís part of the spiritualness of it, you do a good deed and you expect nothing in return, absolutely nothing.

Russ: hmm.

Karra: no money for it for doing that good deed. Expect nothing in return whether it is positive or negative. And when you get something in return, thatís not related to doing the good deed. That is the person learning a spiritual lesson that you made doing the good deed and expecting nothing in return, they do a good deed and expect nothing in return. The fact that it may be back to the person that did the initial good deed is besides the point, you are passing on the spiritual awareness. Actually Kiriís much better at explaining these things than I am.

Russ: no, youíre doing quite a good job actually.

Karra: oh thank you, Kiri would be a little bit more flowery and a little bit more wordy and explain it probably a lot clearer.

Russ: well isnít that one of your jobs as an ambassador doing?

Karra: yes to a certain extent.

Russ: I mean not exactly getting monetarily compensated for what youíre doing.

Karra: no but part of being ambassador is that I have to manipulate people, I have to make them think that theyíre getting what they want when in actual fact they're not.

Russ: but theyíre could say is a form of coercion.

Karra: which makes it very challenging for me because I have very little coercion.

Russ: right but at the same time thatís what youíre doing.

Karra: uh-huh but Iím not so much doing it the way that Kiri does it or the way Mark does it or the way your politicians do it by the mind and presence, Iím doing it by words.

Russ: well but the fact is that you have your own form. Part of your path loosely speaking is not set up the way other peopleís areÖ..

Karra: no.

Russ: itís your own.

Karra: and everybody has their own paths.

Russ: right.

Karra: the spiritual doing good deeds and expecting nothing in return is a very important building block or cornerstone, a foundation for all spiritual awareness. If I recall right, both you and Mark were almost ecstatic when you figured that out.

Russ: well a lot of that had to do with doing the webpage and assisting with the fact that weíre doing a lot of time and effort to get this out and to gain the information and not get money back for it.

Karra: uh-huh so thatís part of doing the good deeds however the webpage is more of disseminating information which is besides the point, it's actually another root foundation stone that is involved with that that you guys havenít figured out yet.

Russ: hmm.

Karra: and the spiritual awareness involved in the growth of learning these basic spiritual commands as they are or building blocks is very important. Some people take many, many lifetimes and they even arrive up here and they havenít learned them. The main important thing is to learn as many as possible whilst on the third dimension but even if you donít learn all of them or even 1/10 of them, you can still make it up here.

Russ: yeah but I wouldnít want to go up there not knowing things that would send me back down because I went up too early.

Karra: I know somebody that only remembers up here.

Russ: yeah but howís he doing?

Karra: she.

Russ: or she.

Karra: sheís doing very well. She comes from a poor family, she works hard, sheís very ambitious, sheís very smart and intuitive and sheís due in about three weeks.

Russ: hmm, who, Lyka?

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: oh.

Karra: donít forget, itís her first time up here......

Russ: hmm.

Karra: and she pushes hard.

Russ: and thatís it and I have a slight edge butÖ.

Karra: weíll see in your waiting period.

Russ: right but the point is whether I come back to thirdÖ.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: or make it up to sixth, I wonít be disappointed or upset or anything like that due to the fact that I know that the lessons I learn here are of a huge benefit when I get there.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: and I think thatís important for everyone to know that itís not a race to get somewhere in your next life, itís a race to be prepared for that when you get there.

Karra: thatís correct. Itís not a race, a race implies that youíve got to cover as quick as possible, no.

Russ: no, thatís true.

Karra: it is an experience, each experience is a step closer towards the goal. Whether it takes somebody thirty years or a hundred years to get to that goal or a hundred and twenty years if youíre fortunate to live that long. Each step, each day, each month is a step closer to that learning experience that may take you to the next level. Itís one thing with people that Iíve watched in their spiritual awareness that claim to be the most highly spiritually aware are in actual fact sometimes the least spiritually aware because they are so focused in the one possibility, the one pathway that all others are excluded and everybody should follow that pathway. Certainly they are very pious and loud preachers but they lack the understanding that whether it is Christianity, Judaism, Muslim, Hinduism, whatever, it is all the paths are the correct path, not just the one. Not just one religion is the path, all religions are the path.

Russ: hmm, thatís important stuff for people to understandÖ

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: that like for example me having a child.......

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: I fully think thatís something that perfectly set me on my path and itís a total change off the path I was on but I canít fault myself for that change in the path because I can already see the changes taking place in me because of that.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: itís a whole other meaning of love.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: which I don't think I was really experiencing. I just need to watch and I can only just say, "hey, ride with it".

Karra: yeah, go with the flow.

Russ: absolutely.

Karra: enjoy the roller coaster because it has been a roller coaster hasnít it recently?

Russ: everyoneís got a roller coasterÖ..

Karra: yes.

Russ: you do, I do, everyone I knowÖ.

Karra: mine doesnít have the humps yours has.

Russ: actually the cats donít have roller coasters.

Karra: you would be surprised.

Russ: I would be surprised.

Karra: uh-huh. Although it does appear like it.

Russ: pretty un-roller coaster-like to me.

Karra: like I have a house cat, he has draped himself kind of across my feet. In fact he looks very relaxed.

Russ: well they got the secret for it.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: no wonder you've got sixth dimensional kittens up there.

Karra: oh yes, sixth dimensional kittens breaking and entering into the fish pond.

Russ: ahh lovely.

Karra: uh-huh. I donít mind them breaking into the fish pond and I donít mind them making off with the fish but when I step in their care packages itís a little bit too much.

Russ: true. My question I've got is on, as you mentioned the studying of the different religions and coming to various answers through thatÖ.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: I mean there is so much to each religion that thereís no way to cover each one but to capture the highlights I donít think would be adequate enough.

Karra: the way it works in learning the necessary bits that you need from each religion is what interests you, what feels right. You can sit down and study one religion in a lifetime and that wouldnít be enough of your lifetime to learn everything that you needed to know to pick out the best pieces. So there is a built-in mechanism within you that aids you in that.

Russ: I would assume it would be like for me meditation of each one. I mean in Christianity when you pray itís meditationÖ.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: with Judaism same thing and all the religions have some form of meditation involved.

Karra: uh-huh but that doesnít work for everybody.

Russ: no true.

Karra: so itís what interests somebody.

Russ: hmm, good point.

Karra: what particular path interests you, what particular path interests Skip, what particular path interests Mark or Laura or anybody else?

Russ: well itís all dependent on our lives prior to this isnít it? To what weíve studied or gone through that feels right.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: and it all kind of blends together into a big jigsaw puzzle that each piece that you discover fits to the next one and you move on and look for the next one after that.

Karra: yes, in essence yes but unfortunately sometimes the pieces donít all fall into place in a nice even pattern. You may get a right-hand corner and then a few weeks later you get a left-hand corner and you donít see how they could fit together.

Russ:  hmm.

Karra: but you need pieces and you hold onto them and then later on you go, "oh, that piece attaches to this piece which leads to that piece which...." and so on until you get to the other form.

Russ: isn't it a point about gathering information and storage?

Karra: uh-huh. You see the human mind is a fantastic tool for that.

Russ: true.

Karra: that there is the potential to gather so much information and hold that information in your mental processes and learn from each particular path.

Russ: hmm true, very true. And another thing is is the people that are involved with each religion thatís important because books donít give you the full insight into what a person believes as opposed to the person themselves.

Karra: thatís correct.

Russ: so actually talking to people about their religions would be very important for that task.

Karra: uh-huh. Take Pat for example. Pat I assume believes very vehemently and passionately in his chosen beliefs.

Russ: uh-huh though he doesnít preach it, Iíve never heard him talk about it except for his fact of that's what he does.

Karra: uh-huh, so what lesson can you learn from Pat?

Russ: unassuming and stay very live and let live attitude is really beneficial as far as for what works for him.

Karra: and he doesnít force his religious beliefs on you.

Russ: not ministering.

Karra: could be applied to what Omal was saying, that he is not out to convert you, he has accepted you for who you are.

Russ: quite true, religion has never even come up as a subject, Iím just wondering how he does his job when gets to where he's gotta go.

Karra: by action I would imagine.

Russ: I would imagine heís very good at what he does once he gets into it.

Karra: I donít think he preaches until the people ask him.

Russ: hmm.

Karra: which is what Omal was saying.

Russ: right.

Karra: and then he doesnít try to convert. He gives the information, tells the parables, tells the stories and then goes, "is there any questions?" Then what do they do? They ask the questions and maybe he talks to a hundred people or a thousand people and out of that he converts one person. That one person needs to be on that pathway and learn from Pat at that time.

Russ: hmm, quite true.

Karra: so therefore he is going about conversion the most correct way of all. By not converting, not going out and preaching and saying that you are, whatís the words that Omal used? To be sent to a hot and infernal place for the rest of your existence.

Russ: oh damned?

Karra: yeah.

Russ: damned to hell.

Karra: Pat is giving them the option of, "if you want to follow my pathway you are welcome, I will aid you in whatever way that you want, Iíll answer whatever questions you want but Iíll not force it upon you if youíre not ready". Which in itself is actually very wise.

Russ: quite true, in fact I emulate that quite heavily already myselfÖ...

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: because people, if thereís a need, itís to be filled and they'll ask for that filling of the need.

Karra: and if not, no matter how hard you try to persuade them, they wonít take that vacancy.

Russ: thatís true.

Karra: that spot will not be filled by your religion, it will be filled by a different one. Even if they are the same religion theyíre not. What did Omal say? A million people of the same religion have a million different religions?

Russ: yep, absolutely.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: hmm.

Karra: the people that do the worst job of converting are the ones that are so passionately in belief of what they are preaching because he will not hear any other way and you must believe their way which is sad.

Russ: thatís true.

Karra: think we're getting close towards the end of the tape, could you check?

Russ: yeah, I'll look......we got about five minutes.

Karra: ahh.

Russ: was there somebody else to talk?

Karra: yes Tia but she says it can wait.

Russ: hmm.

Karra: so the spiritual importance of the growthÖ're going enjoy re-listening to my explanations on our conversation because I've just had it pointed out to me that I've given you three truths. One that you already know and two that are on the tape but youíve got to reason them out.

Russ: I love it.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: well thatís good, I like a good puzzle.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: well like you say, whether I get it or not itís something I will get sooner or later.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: because just watching life taking place around you, you kind of get a feel for how it is to progress upward. For example, this earthquake in TurkeyÖ.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: millions of people in the world are affected by it, not only in Turkey but all around, and itís kind of for us more just an event that happens.

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: and we don't take that event personally but at the same time thereís a lesson there to be learned from that.

Karra: yes there is and learning that lesson applies to the spiritual survival and being spiritual. These people, some of them maintain their survivalism plus their spirituality. Giving thanks to their chosen pathway for bringing them through. Even fewer are surviving and going about their spiritual business as normal and not trying to tell everybody that they have been saved by a deity or anything. They give thanks in their own unique way and carry on with their life and continue with their spiritual growth and also work on the principle of helping those that are less fortunate than themselves.

Russ: thatís true. I mean I guess well the one main lesson a lot of people are learning from this is the fact that whereas before the earthquake they might have been wrapped up in their own worlds, their own troubles, things like that.......

Karra: uh-huh.

Russ: all of a sudden theyíre sitting there and digging through rubble with complete strangers or aiding people theyíve never even talked to before.

Karra: the sad thing is that having been with you as long as I have and seen as many earthquakes and disasters, I see that itís only a temporary thing. Very seldom does something permanent come from it, that the people gradually slip back into their old pathways. A few continue on the pathway that they discovered and thatís part of sifting through the spiritualness and advancing on. A lot of people donít do that, they donít learn for the long term.

Russ: but isnít that one experience a key toward achieving that goal at some point?

Karra: yes to a certain extent. Even if it is only even one person that learns from that lesson, then it is a lesson that has been learned. Maybe an earthquake is for one person to learn a particular experience and all the other people are there as what did Kiri call it? Support actors?

Russ: uh-huh.

Karra: to push that one person along. You see the myriad of possibilities that occurs, and again Iím getting out of my field here, from a situation like that is something that is very difficult to perceive immediately. It is something if you were to say, "okay now, this is going to come from that event". We canít say that, we donít know.

Russ: no but as a healer, you know that from disasters that happen and the fact that somebody whoís never done healing or empathy at all in their life suddenly reaches out to someone to help somebody else, their heart grows a little bit.

Karra: yes, another way to look at it is letís say your planet is the human bodyÖ..

Russ: okay.

Karra: and an earthquake is a severe bruising on the arm.

Russ: okay.

Karra: and your hand, your skin represents people, the ground and everything else.

Russ: uh-huh.

Karra: now the hand coming across with a cold compress is the relief and the support people helping.

Russ: hmm, okay.

Karra: so that using that analogy is that the people going to help are there to soothe but from that bruising of the arm you may learn that if you do that action youíre going to get hurt. So you avoid that action so it is part of the lesson that is to be learned. Or, maybe you hurt your arm and bruise itÖÖ




(Kiri continues from a totally different session from an unknown date and it's all new)

Russ: okay darling now, letís go on to the next phase of this. Okay, we got our shelving, we got our room, now letís work on supplies okay?

Kiri: okay.

Russ: now starting off, weíll have gardening supplies out here in the gardenÖ.

Kiri: yeah.

Russ: should we have backups upstairs then?

Kiri: oh things like shovels and rakes and forks andÖ.

Russ: it's just brand-new ones sitting up for when theyíre needed?

Kiri: yeah.

John: how about our seed supplies? Is that critical for both vegetables, fruits and herbs?

Kiri: yeah, I should say getting fresh ones every two years.

John: fresh seeds every two years?

Kiri: yes.

John: so, say we're in scenario case A and the situation doesnít escalate into B and we should just go ahead and utilize that seeds and replenish our wholeÖ.

Kiri: yeah, in any situation thatís what you should do is replenish and reuse.

John: two years for seeds?

Kiri: yeah two years, yeah.

John: and how about with dried beans and rice and other food staples?

Kiri: two years for that, with that as well, two years.

John: okay.

Kiri: and also I have a translation from Tiaís last statement in cat.

Russ: which is?

Kiri: and it is, "I humbly beg forgiveness, I kiss your buttÖÖ"

(laughter breaks out at that)

Kiri: "but I will have food for you soon".

Russ: no wonder it took so long to tell. Is that Calvin?

(one of the house cats at the time)

Kiri: thatís why Tiaís in hysterics at the moment.

Russ: now then we've got theÖÖ..what about the water stuff? Is that going to take a lot of weight and the problems with the storage of it up there?

Kiri: thatís why we designed it the way we designed it, they go on the ground shelf but they have to be sealed tight, tight.

Amber: uh-huh.

John: have you ever done any backpacking?

Amber: not really.

John: serious backpacking?

Amber: uh-huh.

John: where you take everything you need to live and put on your back and go for a walk, a long walk?

Russ: we need to practice this this summer Johnny.

John: we need to.

Russ: real bad, let's do some Desolation stuff.

John: would you be interested in going backpacking this summer in Desolation Wilderness?

Amber: yeah I would be very interested in that. I need to start learning these things, these skills. Plus, if I could do that, even ifÖ.. 

John: well youíre a natural, youíre a natural for it you know what I mean? You can do so much book learning but hands-on experience in that type of situation is invaluable. Because Iíve been in the woods all alone and almost frozen to deathÖ..

Amber: well thereís only so much book learning you can do when dealing with mother nature.

John: now as long as weíre on the subject, what about mountain bikes, cross-country skisÖÖ

Kiri: yeah, theyíll come in handy.

John: for a more viable means of transportation then our conventional gasoline engines?

Russ: I think the cross-country skis are a good idea you're thinking of.

Kiri: yeah.

Russ: I got to learn how to do that.

John: well itís easy, youíd catch it right away.

Russ: yeah shouldn't be too tough, I can do it already on regular skis.

John: yeah, you'd get it right away.

Kiri: yeah, uh-huh.

John: how about horses and livestock? Should weÖÖ?

Kiri: you donít have a place but you should know where you can get a hold of them.

Russ: or how to take care of them.

Kiri: yeah, well Mark can take care of horses.

John: and Iím not just asking questions for Russ and our household here but there's other peoples that Iím associated with that need this information and itís invaluable.

Kiri: yes, horses.

Russ: on another thought here, we are going to be working with others as a communityÖ

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: I mean itís not just going to be whoever happens to be here in the house and our supplies it's going to be all dependent on, weíre talking about a basic core group of peopleÖÖ

Kiri: yeah.

Russ: living in many different houses depending on each other for the same stuff no matter what scenario we're talking about here.

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: so therefore some of these skills that we're looking at that we need to learn, are stuff that we can pass on to others who have not the necessary knowledge or abilities.

Kiri: uh-huh, yes certainly.

Russ: so anything we can learn is not going to be uselessÖ.

Amber: uh-huh.

Russ: because we can always pass it on to somebody who can use it even better than we could possibly.

Kiri: uh-huh.

John: on a more serious note, Iíd eat the bark off a tree.

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: scenario C.

Kiri: yes.

Russ: bark off a tree, scenario C, you got it yeah.

Amber: now I was once told that every single part of a pine tree is edibleÖ

Kiri: uh-huh.

Amber: is that true?

Kiri: pretty much so yeah.

Amber: youíd never really starve to death up here.

Kiri: well thatís a funny thing about a disaster that happened in 1848, well winter of 1848, 1847 is that they resorted to the worst form of survival but yet food was all around them.

Russ: you mean the Donner party?

Kiri: well itís not a party I was invited to and it's not a party I wouldíve gone to. Well I think we do haveÖ

John: Mark and I have observed the outdoor cats eating pine nuts.

Kiri: uh-huh.

John: do the felines here actually eat pine nuts and is that one of their survival staples?

Kiri: very high in protein, yes.

John: so they weren't just playing with them, they were actually eating them and ingesting them?

Kiri: Tia says yes.

John: supplementing their diet?

Russ: thatís something we can stock up on too.

Kiri: Tiaís saying yes.

John: why not? You can do all kinds of stuff with them.

Kiri: and Russ, I think we have an answer to a long-time problem.

Russ: what?

Kiri: you know the project whatever it is?

Russ: yeah right.

Kiri: yeah I think we have an answer to it.

Russ: oh good.

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: okay, whatever works.

John: all right letís get serious.

Kiri: okay Iíll let you talk among yourselves whilst you discuss things. Iím going to go and cause trouble.

Russ: too much tea?

Kiri: uh-uh.

John: donít you go driving Markís car now.

Russ: okay, now another thing we need to stock up on is to use some of that storage space up there as a library.

John: yes.

Russ: and pick up books on survival skills, basic engineering skills, healing skillsÖ.

John: topo maps would be handy, yeah, a regular library.

Russ: yeah, a regular library.........I'll be right back, hold on.

John: okay, you got it.

well if there's trouble, maybe I can't wait for that.

John: yeah, rather figure........

Russ: you want to pause the tape real quick Johnny?

John: yeah, yeah, you got it.

Russ: thanks dude..........

(John pauses the tape for a bit and then hits unpause)

Russ: we're back on live.

Kiri: okay, weíre back on live huh?

Russ: yeah.

Kiri: last but not leastÖÖ

Russ: oh by the way wait, before you go darlingÖ.

Kiri: uh-huh.

Russ: Johnny and I were discussing the possibility of putting a nice library in.

Kiri: hmm yes, survival books and so on, yes.

Russ: the whole nine yards, engineering skills which I would like you to possibly recommend to us at some point in the future hereÖ..

Kiri: okay.....oooh.

Russ: or give us the okay on.

Kiri: okay.

Russ: oooh what?

Kiri: got to go, I'm being paged.

John: later.

Russ: okay, farewell.

(Tia is the ring mistress for this channeling session)

John: good, Iíve already got questions for next week. Itís a good session, Iím glad Mark took that nap.

Russ: hi Tia.

(Tia says hi in Durondedunn)

Russ: whatís up babe?

Tia: oohhhh, all sorts of things.

Russ: ďexcuse me, Iím going to kiss your buttís?Ē

Tia: she wasnít meant to tell you, I was laughing about it.

Russ: yeah well, Iím glad she did prior to me memorizing your phrases of yours.

(Tia blows a raspberry and repeats the phrase Kiri had translated)

Russ: uh-huh right, forget that.

Tia: oh Amber, are you going to come next week? Iím personally inviting you.

Amber: okay.

Tia: uh-huh, okay? Uh-huh, we'll send Buster down to pick you up or this Buster here, whoever.

Russ: my truck should be working by then.

Amber: it will be on Tuesday night?

Tia: uh-huh.

Amber: okay.

Tia: okay, who would you like to pick you up?

Amber: it doesnít matter.

Russ: whoeverís working the carís best probably with the most gas.

John: yeah, anyone of us can do it.

Tia: okay, whoever. Okay Iíve got to put on the heavies, or heavy.

John: oh, here comes Omal.

Russ: okay, bye love.

Tia: okay?

(Tia sings a song from America....sort of)

Russ: Omal will be a welcome change.

(that brings on some laughter)

Tia: watch it sonny. If I could come down there right now Iíd bop you oneÖÖ I wouldnít, Iím in too good a mood, Iím horny. Bye.

Russ: bye.

John: horny little......

Russ: sheíll go find Mark.

Tia: I havenít left yet.

Russ: well you will find Mark.

John: go find him, you horn dog you, you wench.

Russ: horn kitty.

(Tia hisses her way out of her seat)

(Omal gets things back to a semblance of order)

Omal: greetings and felicitations. Greetings Amber, greetings Johnny, greetings apprentice communicator.

Russ: greetings Omal.

John: greetings Omal.

Amber: greetings.

Omal: okay, let us proceed and how is the New York Wild Bunch coming?

John: my family is quite strong and quite good and they are continuing with the preparations.

Omal: okay so they are becoming the Hole in the Wall Gang. Who is Butch and who is Sundance?

John: thatís hard to say at any given time. I donít even know if Iím going to be in a position to rejoin them or where Iím going to be when one of these scenarios happens.

Omal: okay.

John: I might be here, I might be there, I could be anywhere.

Omal: okay, now down to serious business from the humor of the Wild Bunch or the Hole in the Wall Gang. Okay, questions please.

Russ: I'll let you guys start this time.

John: thereís been numerous sightings around Mexico and Mexico City? And Iím wondering if it is friendly UFO activity or unfriendly?

Omal: mainly friendly, mainly friendly.

John: there seems to be a large increase of activity in the whole southern hemisphere, are you right now beefing up operations so to speak?

Omal: we are not, we are monitoring the situations and filtering out hostiles as much as possible. Occasionally and unfortunately some of our vessels are spotted and reported in your popular press. The pilots responsible are dealt with and situations like that do not arise as often.

John: is part of our perceiving your activity more and more due to our technology?

Omal: yes but it is not just us.

John: but you are continuously monitoring us?

Omal: correct, yes.

John: and intervening?

Omal: whenever necessary.

John: go ahead Amber.

Russ: on the spot over there.

John: itís been puzzling me thisÖÖ.

Omal: let me get the spotlightÖ..there.

Russ: okay Omal, we are dealing with the three various scenariosÖ.

Omal: correct.

Russ: and I wanted to ask you some of the results and outcomes of each of the three.

Omal: all three lead on various similar paths to a lesser or greater extent.

Russ: okay.

Omal: the worst-case scenario is a long time in reconstruction and therefore slows down the next stage in development. Situation B slows it down but not as much and again increases the delay in the spiritual development. Situation A it proceeds at the current speed that is going. A combination of A and B as you correctly surmised does in actual fact accelerate it.

Russ: okay.

John: am I correct in assuming that we are in scenario A right now as we speak?

Omal: at the very beginning.

John: thank you. Go ahead, sorry.

Russ: no problem. All right now you say that scenario A into B works for the best for us theoretically.

Omal: theoretically.

Russ: okay, now how does that work on a spiritual development scale for those of us who are just on an individual level, as teachers and stuff?

Omal: correct.

Russ: we work on those people who dealing with the stress of the situation and teach them?

Omal: correct. Yes, in essence yes, but it is a little bit more than that. Basically what you are doing is by helping others, you are helping yourself in the process by being an ear that listens and gives good, sound advice, then you also are learning. And by learning you learn that you can do better and so therefore you feel better and you help more people and in turn that makes you feel better and them better so you learn more and so on.

Russ: now do you perceive possibly that these sessions that weíre having could lead to a larger group of people thus necessitating a larger room possibly?

Omal: possibly yes.

Russ: a bigger pyramid.

Omal: a bigger pyramid, a bigger room.

Russ: right, I see what you mean.

Omal: or, same size pyramid just bigger room.

Russ: oh yeah right. Okay, Johnny?

John: youíve overheard our discussions and our planning with our suppliesÖ.

Omal: yes.

John: and we do have to deal with third dimensional monetary situations and, as far as priorities, you would say number one would be the construction of the storage?

Omal: yes I would.

Russ: okay now, Johnny and I were working on figuring out the best, easiest and most available form of energy for the coming up time. Candles are not going to do the trick, batteries will do okay if we have like little solar juices but how do we power?

Omal: there are many different ways of power.

Russ: right well we donít have wind to really speak of as much as weíd likeÖ..

Omal: uh-huh.

Russ: to do our job for us and water is not going to be viable because we donít live close enough to a water source that is flowing.

Omal: thatís where you construct one.

Russ: construct one?

Omal: you have a two-story house or almost a three-story house.

Russ: yeah?

John: yeah?

Omal: you have a reservoir at the top and it pours down and in turn turns a turbine which generates power and it uses less power to transport it back up and around.

Russ: oh I see what you mean, so itís a self-sustaining deviceÖ.

Omal: correct.

Russ: turning in energyÖÖoh, okay. And the speed of the water controls the speed of the turbine.

Omal: correct.

Russ: wow that's a plan I hadnít thought of, I can pick up the parts for that fairly cheaply too. Okay so the only trick is just filling up the reservoir.

Omal: correct, preferably a large reservoir.

Russ: now how is the water transported back up on top though?

Omal: through a pipe that leads back up.

Russ: I mean how is it pushed back up?

Omal: you use part of the energy that is generatedÖÖ

Russ: right.

Omal: and that is used to pump it back up.

Russ: oh I see, a pump is hooked up on the side.

Omal: yes.

Russ: oh okay, wow. Johnny you missed that, itís incredible, a self-sustaining pump system to supply the energy. We're not going to get much juice out of it.

Omal: but it would be enough to power an electric light.

Russ: ahhh.

John: what about solar? Incorporating solar?

Omal: yes that would work.

John: passive solar pre-heater possibly?

Omal: uh-huh.

Russ: for the water?

John: can we incorporate both systems together where they would interact?

Omal: yes, very much so.

John: do we have this technology and information available?

Omal: readily available.

John: so okay, Iíve got access to some of this information. So we should just pretty much use the alternative power sources that are available to usÖÖ

Omal: correct, yes.

John: and that we know of?

Omal: what you could do for generating power by using heat convection is on top of your chimney you could put a set of blades which is turned by the heat connected to a dynamo. You fire up the fire, you generate electricity. Not only are you creating heating for the housing but youíre also creating electrical power.

John: so with a combination of hydroelectric, solarÖÖ

Omal: thermal electric.

John: thermal, hydroelectric and thermoelectric?

Omal: uh-huh.

John: would an assistance basically be combined with what you described?

Omal: yes, they would all be combined together.

Russ: well the thermoelectric would be run by the fireplace, how would that connect up with the others?

Omal: well when youíre not using one, youíre using another one.

John: and wind and we can incorporate a windmill.

Russ: oh I see, so in another words at night when thereís no solar, weíre heating the water up with thermal of course. Ahh okay.

John: and all these things that youíre discussing I could incorporate on the ranch in Sedona.

Omal: correct.

John: and my family could also incorporate it in our Hole in the Wall Gang back East.

Omal: correct, yes.

Russ: so free, cheap power.

John: yeah, thereís people out there right now that are selling power, excess electricity back to the electric company.

Russ: now OmalÖ..

Omal: uh-huh.

Russ: in each of the scenarios that we discussed, scenario A looks like the most possible for continuing the power that we currently use now. So it would only be scenario B that we have to go to these measures that we're discussing.

Omal: correct, yes.

Russ: but to have them available, we could use them even in scenario A and save not only money but in power outages.......

Omal: correct, yes.

Russ: and the sharing of the technology among others that we're working with would probably be the best bet too.

Omal: of course, yes.

Russ: okay.

John: and we can also incorporate these technologies in a backpacking extreme scenario.

Omal: of course, yes. They are quite thoughtful.

John: using black bags and solar showers and evaporation water units are relatively easy toÖ..

Omal: and also mirrors too.

Russ: oh yeah for solar cooking.

John: and how do we incorporate the mirrors exactly?

Omal: you create them at such a curved angle that they reflect and focus on a central focusing point.

Russ: you can get 2000į out of one of those things.

John: well I know you can paint a can black and make it into an oven.

Omal: magnifying glasses and so on.

Russ: sure, hmm okay. Any other suggestions for us as far as things we've overlooked tonight?

Omal: you have covered the library, you have covered medical supplies, survival suppliesÖ..

John: one thing that we didnít touch on in our survival supplies is water purification tablets. We did discuss a distillation system......

Omal: uh-huh.

John: should we have water purification tablets available?

Omal: if necessary, yes.

John: okay, itís something I donít like to leave home without.

Russ: well if we are having to bring water up from the lakeÖ.

John: you'd want to purify it.

Russ: we could have the distillation unit but we could also that way purify itÖÖ

John: purify it and utilize it quicker.

Russ: okay right, cool. Okay and then of course weíre going to be getting help from you throughout all this mess.

Omal: of course, yes.

Russ: so that will be really nice.

Omal: okay, it seems that you are ending up on your questions.

Russ: thatís it for me.

Omal: young lady?

Amber: no.

Omal: Johnny?

John: is there anything that we're not doing right now that we should be that you can perceive?

Omal: expanding your knowledge on alternative engineering equipment.

John: okay, Iíve got access to some of that information, Iíll expedite that.

Omal: Russ.

Russ: uh-huh?

Omal: last question.

Russ: well Karra was talking a lot about surgical stuff, I would assume surgical techniques will be really high of a priority of learning.

Omal: basic surgery, basic surgery yes.

Russ: basic surgery. So weíre not talking about going to go into someoneís stomach and trying to remove appendixís or are we?

Omal: no.

Russ: okay, weíre talking about pulling out bullets andÖ

Omal: yes.

Russ: fixing up cuts and bones and lacerationsÖ.

John: and I've got a good background in that.

Russ: and....

John: I never sewn anyone up but.......

Russ: the knowledge of that would come in handy.

Omal: yes.

Russ: and also, oh nevermind, thatís my last question.

(Russ starts to laugh heartily)

Omal: it was worth a try. 

Russ: it was worth a try.

Omal: okayÖ..

Russ: farewell Omal.

John: thank you for your patience.

Omal: live long, prosper, and Iíll be back. Iíll take the Uzi 9 mm with laser sights. Team one to beam up.

(Tia returns to finish up the side)

John: but thereís an awful lot of knowledge out there aboutÖ.

Tia: fish, fish oils, all sorts of interesting things.

Russ: drying them, smoking them.

Tia: uh-huh.

John: yeah.

Tia: yeah, but I donít like smoking them, when you inhale you tend to cough a lot.

John: I have a hard time keeping their heads lit when I try and smoke them.

Tia: hmm, yes.

Russ: their scales clog my pipe.

Tia: okay, your turn to make a comment young lady about smoking.

Amber: I wasnít going to say anything.

Tia: I believe we're almost out of tape as well.

John: ahh yeah, weíre real close.

Russ: weíre getting down to that point, weíve got maybe three minutes, five minutes left, something like that.

Tia: uh-huh, we can have idle chitchat now.

Russ: oh good, going to get some hot eggnog.

John: I was going to grab it but I didnít think you were going to have another cup for some reason Rush.

Tia: Kiri has her own ideas and stuff. Yeah but I look forward to talking to you next week. Yeah, looking forward to it. If you bring in some notes and questions that you want answered and all sorts of things, Kiri and myself are willing to answer.

Amber: okay, Iíll start keeping track of questions that come to me.

Tia: yeah, we canít tell you whatís going to happen in the future, we can give you probabilities which is what we did tonight.

Amber: I donít think itís good to know for sure anyways.

Tia: no.

Amber: no.

Russ: now TiaÖ

Tia: uh-huh?

Russ: Omal was mentioning that our future would be best served by actually going from level A....or scenario A to scenario B.

Tia: uh-huh, yeah.

Russ: I canít quite understand why except for the fact that it'd draw people closer together from going one minor catastrophe to a bigger catastrophe.

Tia: uh-huh, the people will draw together from what they perceive as a major catastrophe but in actual fact itís a minor catastrophe, it draws them together and theyíre already together for the major catastrophe.

Russ: so what happens if C happens?

Tia: oh dear.

Russ: everyone's &%$#@*?

Tia: yeah, run for the hills.

Russ: at least you go as one big group.

Tia: "yeah but theyíre coming from the hills". "Okay, you see the hills, run the other way".

John: and with these scenariosÖ..

Tia: uh-huh.

John: doesnít the term survival of the fittest come into play here?

Tia: yes it does actually.

John: is this going to be a natural thinning of the population?

Russ: I disagree, I think itís survival of the most prepared.

Amber: what Iíd like to askÖ.

Tia: uh-huh.

Amber: and maybe I should wait for next week but Iím not sure if Tahoe for me would be a good place for me to be when all this happens, I donít know. What part of the countryÖÖ?

Tia: somewhere that is sparsely populated, somewhere that has easy, defensible area, somewhere where you can retreat and disappear into. To me, guess where that sounds like?

Russ: Tahoe.

Tia: uh-huh.

John: uh-uh, sounds like my familyís place back home to me.

Russ: well I donít know what that looks like.

John: oh God, youíve got to go back there, youíve got it check this Rush. I meanÖ

Tia: can I ask you a question?

John: yeah.

Tia: why do you keep on calling him Rush?

John: itís a nickname. Like Mark calls me AceÖ..

Tia: oh.

John: and lately Iíve been calling Mark Sport.

Tia: I thought it might be likeÖÖ

John: but Rush, it has a lot to do with him being a communicator.

Tia: oh, like Mr. Rush Limbaugh.

John: no, no, this is Mr. Rush Hatfield which is on a whole different level then Rush Limbaugh.

Russ: Liberal Democrat.

John: yeah, heís on the other extreme of the political line but he is probably a lot more intense and every bit if not more intelligent, in my opinion.

Russ: well, I donít think I could keep up a conversation with Rush if I tried.

Tia: I donít listen to Rush, I preferred Liddy myself, the G-man but there again Mr. Limbo.....Limbaugh does has some very interesting points butÖ..

John: yes he does.

Tia: as Iíve stated in the past, first of all he is a entertainer.

John: okay but your question with me referring to Russ as RushÖ..

Tia: yes, Hush the Russ.

John: is not associated with Rush Limbaugh, that would be an insult to him.

Tia: it would be an insult to both of them actually.

John: yeah, itíd be an insult to Rush Limbaugh for sure.

Tia: yes andÖ..

Russ: what I canít figure out, if Liddy was such a good burglar, how come he was advising people on how to shoot ATF agents in the head?

Tia: because he sees ATF agents as a rogue agency now.

Russ: probably sees them as competition.

Tia: probably yes but he does play good music that I like.

Russ: does he?

Tia: uh-huh.

Russ: I donít know.

Tia: yeah, at the start of each segment he plays a piece of music saluting a particular branch of the armed services.

Russ: which ones?

Tia: whichever one he chooses to be of that day.

Russ: oh, sounds very patriotic. Well that brings me to another question, I mean weíre doing different scenarios hereÖ.

Tia: uh-huh.

Russ: each one of these A, B and C that we got going, we're not taking into account the militias.

Tia: yes we have.

Russ: yeah as part of the external forces thatÖ.

Tia: the private armies.

Russ: the private armies right. But thatís only in scenario C that we were talking about.

Tia: thatís where they become most prevalent.

Russ: right, what about the other two scenarios?

Tia: they play a little role but nothing major.

Russ: so A, they become stronger, B, they become stronger yet.

Tia: and C they become dominant.

Russ: dominant, got it.

Tia: yeah I think the tape is just about ready to run out.

Russ: have fun darling.

Tia: yeah, I've got to go.

Russ: bye love.

Tia: talk amongst yourselves.

Russ: oh we will.

John: see you.

Russ: bye love.

Tia: see you, wouldnít want to be you. That should goof him up.

(Tia says goodbye in Durondedunn)

Russ: okay.

John: fascinating session.


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